Fire Alarm Systems

That a relief I was beginning to doubt myself there .

Oh life is sweet sometimes,aforementioned sales engineer is coming back next week with some brochures and prices,I think I am going to get into "rogue traders" mode .

johnson Wrote:Oh life is sweet sometimes,aforementioned sales engineer is coming back next week with some brochures and prices,I think I am going to get into "rogue traders" mode .

Make sure you bring a camera and post pictures of him trying to worm his way out of it when you jump out of the cupboard and say, "you're talking shite mate, ***** off!". Hahaha

Wiz Wrote:BS5839 allows the use of 4 core cables unless these cores are serving two different circuits. i.e a zone circuit and a sounder circuit.

Have you got that the right way round Wiz?

I can understand not having two of the same circuit ie. two sounder circuits in the same cable but I can't find where it says you can't install a zone and a sounder circuit in a 4 core.

ESP Wrote:

Wiz Wrote:BS5839 allows the use of 4 core cables unless these cores are serving two different circuits. i.e a zone circuit and a sounder circuit.

Have you got that the right way round Wiz?

I can understand not having two of the same circuit ie. two sounder circuits in the same cable but I can't find where it says you can't install a zone and a sounder circuit in a 4 core.

I'm glad you picked up on that Dave. I was hoping someone would. My interpretation is based on a specific BS clause and relating it to the widely held view that any damage to a cable is considered to always have affected all cores in that cable. Not everyone will agree with my interpretation and I accept that.


The BS clause in question is 12.2.2.A) A fault on one circuit containing manual call points, fire detectors or fire alarm devices, or a combination of them, should not affect any other circuit. If you had both a detection and alarm circuit in the same 4-core then it would not meet this clause, in my interpretation.

As I previously said, I can understand someone not agreeing with my interpretation, but it is this interpretation which would stop me using 4 core circuits in the specific circumstances above. I also wouldn't put two different detection circuits in the same 4-core either

My original post was in response to someone who said the the BS recommendations disallowed the use of 4-core in all circumstances. I believe that to be a wrong statement. I therefore suggested that it could be used in many many circumstances and I was pointing out those few examples in BS where the use was specifically not recommended, including one that was an interpretation.

Have to admit I'd overlooked that one.... it is a bit grey but I see where you're coming from, although it would seem a little extreme .....

I suppose it depends on whether you interpret the "circuit fault" as being a consequence of a cable fault.

.... food for thought......

Wiz Wrote:

ESP Wrote:

Wiz Wrote:BS5839 allows the use of 4 core cables unless these cores are serving two different circuits. i.e a zone circuit and a sounder circuit.

Have you got that the right way round Wiz?

I can understand not having two of the same circuit ie. two sounder circuits in the same cable but I can't find where it says you can't install a zone and a sounder circuit in a 4 core.

I'm glad you picked up on that Dave. I was hoping someone would. My interpretation is based on a specific BS clause and relating it to the widely held view that any damage to a cable is considered to always have affected all cores in that cable. Not everyone will agree with my interpretation and I accept that.


The BS clause in question is 12.2.2.A) A fault on one circuit containing manual call points, fire detectors or fire alarm devices, or a combination of them, should not affect any other circuit. If you had both a detection and alarm circuit in the same 4-core then it would not meet this clause, in my interpretation.

As I previously said, I can understand someone not agreeing with my interpretation, but it is this interpretation which would stop me using 4 core circuits in the specific circumstances above. I also wouldn't put two different detection circuits in the same 4-core either

My original post was in response to someone who said the the BS recommendations disallowed the use of 4-core in all circumstances. I believe that to be a wrong statement. I therefore suggested that it could be used in many many circumstances and I was pointing out those few examples in BS where the use was specifically not recommended, including one that was an interpretation.

that's how i interpret that clause also Wizzy. No to a zone a sounder line in the same cable.

Unless it's savwire.... or analogue....!!

I've heard some desperate sales tricks to sell new kit, but the colour of the charging LEDs......

Reminds me of '97-'98 when the 'because it's not a red extinguisher you must replace it ' brigade were going strong...